Great question that provokes much thought, Laura. I agree; too much gratitude could invalidate the seriousness and necessity for addressing difficult situations. And like Cissy said, self-care is awesome, but it doesn't quite work for someone who currently has self-hate. It's so important to accept both gratitude and ingratitude, happy and angry, easy-going and difficult. Life is about all of these and more. So although the overall goal is something positive, we must recognize and accept that there will be some negatives.

I love the ingratitude list article, and thank you for sharing that in a separate blog post, Laura! 

Repeating after Gail, I'm so happy that conversations like these are taking place in the community. Fantastic!

Thanks for raising the question, Laura. I too believe in the power of being grateful (Read 'The Book of Joy' for some words of wisdom about this from the Dalai Lama and Desmond Tutu) BUT I absolutely agree that sometimes it feels to me that gratitude can be used as a simple answer to address painful, difficult situations. I really do not believe those that have done the work about gratitude intend this (nor the Dalai Lama and Desmond Tutu - their chapters include things like 'Nothing Beautiful Comes Without Some Suffering" and "Suffering and Adversity: Passing through Difficulties" ) but I am aware that folks may want to try and shortcut to gratitude without doing the work on addressing adversity and pain before going there.
Thank you Laura for posting the GH article (She seemed to speak right to that) and I am thrilled we can have these dialogs in this community!

Christine Cissy White posted:

Laura Pinhey posted:

This is sure good news for all of us, but in the context of this group, it’s especially useful to anyone hoping to combat the possible long-term effects of ACEs/trauma on cardiovascular health (and just wanting to heal). My concern for ACEs/trauma survivors (or anyone, really) is that sometimes cultivating gratitude can come at the cost of fully acknowledging and processing traumas. There can be a sense guilt just for admitting to oneself — not to mention others — that some very bad things have happened that have had a lasting impact. The survivor can end up dismissing or normalizing what happened to them because despite those ACEs, they may still have much to be grateful for. “Things weren’t ALL bad, therefore maybe I’m overreacting, making a mountain out of a molehill—maybe it’s just me.” It can muddy the waters of recovery if care is not taken to totally accept the traumatic experiences as just that, along with recognizing positive aspects of one’s life.

There has been so much in the news and on social media in the past few years about the importance and benefits of gratitude; I’m all for it, but I do think it can go too far when it results in “pooh poohing” difficult experiences or emotions and sweeping them under the rug rather than facing them and dealing with them.

I’m speaking from personal experience. Anyone else?

Laura: 

Please feel free to share these articles as a post so more people will see them. I LOVE the ingratitude list and your comment. To me, it reads like a blog post and I LOVE your voice. It's clear, curious and honest. 

I LOVE gratitude lists. Now, after my 40's, but while knee-deep in healing I wanted to punch anyone who said something that felt like, "Turn that frown upside down" because it felt minimizing. It didn't just feel minimizing, sometimes it was, as in denial. 

Plus, all the self-care in the world is wonderful but only if someone is not still in active self-hate. In which case, self-care feels like total BS and it's why positive affirmations don't always work as well. It's like cooking together cake mix and sugar and salt and putting it all in the pan without any milk, water, yogurt, applesauce or butter. That's not going to make a cake without all of the ingredients even if some of the ingredients are in the pan and the oven is warmed to the just right temp. 

Sometimes, we need to be yelling, "Where the hell is the milk and why won't this cake rise?" to find out that there are a few missing ingredients and not just that we need to keep trying to make the cake without all the ingredients needed. And that without the ingredients being told to make the cake (or do a gratitude list, or say positive affirmations) can cause more frustration rather than healing. 

And, at another time, those practices might be spot on and healing and magical. But it's not one size fits all or the entire same process for all. So please keep bringing your voice, article, ideas, and perspective because it's ALL important and it's ALL welcome. 

This is a place for discussion and sharing and reflecting and not for prescriptions or rules about resilience. Gratitude lists can save some people and can harm or hurt others. Both things can be true and can even be true for the same person in the same life. I know. 

For me, when in agony and crisis, nothing was more healing than learning how to identify and articulate at least to myself exactly the reality of my experiences. I was not feeling grateful and being able to say so took all the pressure to pass as happy, perky, successful. When I tried to pretend I was not grieving, not anxious, not having nightmare hangovers, etc. I felt like a pressure cooker. When I could admit how hard it was I found more space and energy and space not holding it all in or trying to control it all. It was an epic relief. 

My comment went long but this is a community for all of us to contribute to and I already love your contributions.

Cis

Your analogy of baking a cake is spot on (speaking of reading like a blog post )-- the desired ingredients will vary from baker to baker and from cake to cake, but without all the essentials, we're just not going to end up with a cake and we have to admit that and then do something about it or go cakeless .... which would be a shame.

Let me reiterate -- I am all for gratitude lists and for an "attitude of gratitude". My husband and I still have a gratitude list still on our laptop desktop from a few years ago when we were going through a really hard time. I look at it now and again and, yes, because we're very fortunate, the items there still apply. It does help to remind myself of that. And I actually fall asleep most nights counting my blessings (shout outs to "White Christmas" movie fans) and reviewing what went well that day. But for many years gratitude bordered on denial, which is a pretty common barrier to healing. 

Thanks for the kind words about my posts and my writing voice. And I say, right (write?) back atcha about your posts. I love to write and I guess sometimes it shows.

Laura Pinhey posted:

This is sure good news for all of us, but in the context of this group, it’s especially useful to anyone hoping to combat the possible long-term effects of ACEs/trauma on cardiovascular health (and just wanting to heal). My concern for ACEs/trauma survivors (or anyone, really) is that sometimes cultivating gratitude can come at the cost of fully acknowledging and processing traumas. There can be a sense guilt just for admitting to oneself — not to mention others — that some very bad things have happened that have had a lasting impact. The survivor can end up dismissing or normalizing what happened to them because despite those ACEs, they may still have much to be grateful for. “Things weren’t ALL bad, therefore maybe I’m overreacting, making a mountain out of a molehill—maybe it’s just me.” It can muddy the waters of recovery if care is not taken to totally accept the traumatic experiences as just that, along with recognizing positive aspects of one’s life.

There has been so much in the news and on social media in the past few years about the importance and benefits of gratitude; I’m all for it, but I do think it can go too far when it results in “pooh poohing” difficult experiences or emotions and sweeping them under the rug rather than facing them and dealing with them.

I’m speaking from personal experience. Anyone else?

Laura: 

Please feel free to share these articles as a post so more people will see them. I LOVE the ingratitude list and your comment. To me, it reads like a blog post and I LOVE your voice. It's clear, curious and honest. 

I LOVE gratitude lists. Now, after my 40's, but while knee-deep in healing I wanted to punch anyone who said something that felt like, "Turn that frown upside down" because it felt minimizing. It didn't just feel minimizing, sometimes it was, as in denial. 

Plus, all the self-care in the world is wonderful but only if someone is not still in active self-hate. In which case, self-care feels like total BS and it's why positive affirmations don't always work as well. It's like cooking together cake mix and sugar and salt and putting it all in the pan without any milk, water, yogurt, applesauce or butter. That's not going to make a cake without all of the ingredients even if some of the ingredients are in the pan and the oven is warmed to the just right temp. 

Sometimes, we need to be yelling, "Where the hell is the milk and why won't this cake rise?" to find out that there are a few missing ingredients and not just that we need to keep trying to make the cake without all the ingredients needed. And that without the ingredients being told to make the cake (or do a gratitude list, or say positive affirmations) can cause more frustration rather than healing. 

And, at another time, those practices might be spot on and healing and magical. But it's not one size fits all or the entire same process for all. So please keep bringing your voice, article, ideas, and perspective because it's ALL important and it's ALL welcome. 

This is a place for discussion and sharing and reflecting and not for prescriptions or rules about resilience. Gratitude lists can save some people and can harm or hurt others. Both things can be true and can even be true for the same person in the same life. I know. 

For me, when in agony and crisis, nothing was more healing than learning how to identify and articulate at least to myself exactly the reality of my experiences. I was not feeling grateful and being able to say so took all the pressure to pass as happy, perky, successful. When I tried to pretend I was not grieving, not anxious, not having nightmare hangovers, etc. I felt like a pressure cooker. When I could admit how hard it was I found more space and energy and space not holding it all in or trying to control it all. It was an epic relief. 

My comment went long but this is a community for all of us to contribute to and I already love your contributions.

Cis

For an "alternative" view on gratitude, check this out: 

"Gratitude Lists Are B.S. — It Was an 'Ingratitude' List That Saved Me" by Liz Brown

http://www.goodhousekeeping.co...ude-lists-dont-work/

This is sure good news for all of us, but in the context of this group, it’s especially useful to anyone hoping to combat the possible long-term effects of ACEs/trauma on cardiovascular health (and just wanting to heal). My concern for ACEs/trauma survivors (or anyone, really) is that sometimes cultivating gratitude can come at the cost of fully acknowledging and processing traumas. There can be a sense guilt just for admitting to oneself — not to mention others — that some very bad things have happened that have had a lasting impact. The survivor can end up dismissing or normalizing what happened to them because despite those ACEs, they may still have much to be grateful for. “Things weren’t ALL bad, therefore maybe I’m overreacting, making a mountain out of a molehill—maybe it’s just me.” It can muddy the waters of recovery if care is not taken to totally accept the traumatic experiences as just that, along with recognizing positive aspects of one’s life.

There has been so much in the news and on social media in the past few years about the importance and benefits of gratitude; I’m all for it, but I do think it can go too far when it results in “pooh poohing” difficult experiences or emotions and sweeping them under the rug rather than facing them and dealing with them.

I’m speaking from personal experience. Anyone else?